Ringing Forums

courses can be part of the solution but not the whole. After attending a course the student needs to return to an environment where he/she can build on and consolidate what’s been learnt.

[reply="John de Overa;d496". Your situation illustrates part of the problem that Ringing 2030 is hoping to address. How much headway it will make is yet to be seen.
There are already places where that statement is true. If Ringing 2030 makes an impact it will be true in more places, which would surely make it worthwhile.
No doubt there will always be some places where it is not true, whatever we do. But I’m not sure watering down the vision statement would help.

a comment against most lines explaining the calculation behind it and details of what the expenditure is for — Jason Carter

That's a sensible suggestion. In many cases at the budgetary stage it will be a wet finger guess, but some indication of the thinking behind it would be helpful.

While it's good not to be too prescriptive mabout 'how' a job should be done, going to the other extreme isn't helpful. Someone new in post needs to know 'what' needs to be done. A definitive list is better than hoping the outgoing office holder will remember to mention everything, or that the incoming office holder will manage to work everything out (in time not to get caught out).
Guild rules are unlikely to have anything like enough detail. Typically they just list what roles there should be, with no indication of who does what.

we have comprehensive job descriptions of branch officers at: https://odg.org.uk/sdb/documents/other/JobDescriptions.pdf
The other place to look is the CC publication ‘Getting it right’, which is about running societies. I can’t find it in the CC Shop so maybe it’s out of print, but there must be some copies around.

most replacements involve a single rope, in which case the best guide is to make it 5he same as the ropes either side, or the average if they are different.

we’ve been using pre stretched polyester for 40 years and had no evidence of garter hole wear.

like to donate “push button” automatic sound contro — Steve Farmer

IT needn't be quite that high tech. We just release four cords in the ringing room, which is just as easy. And we do sometimes close the shutters selectively on the side with houses nearest.

came from the HLF rather than the Association, it seems ironic that it's easier to get funding for that sort of thing from external funding bodies than it is from our own sources. — John de Overa

Indeed. But it merely reflects that the HLF was set up for broad support of cultural activities whereas BRFs were set up with a narrow focus on hardware. Why they were so set up, and the culture behind it is another matter.

I admit I was replying to the point about the Charity Commission, which is a legal point, and I didn't spot the reference to persuading members. Yes, members would need to agree to changes, but in the current climate that is something to work through rather than a reason not to try. The CC has modernised itself. Several societies have also done so, and my own Guild has just embarked on the process. If those changes are possible, so are changes to how we prioritise the use of money.

That would require the agreement of both the association membership and The Charity Commission ... That it will likely be difficult and time consuming. — John de Overa

That doesn't follow. The Charity Comission is primarily concerned with whether a charity spends it's money to achieve charitable purposes. If a charity is not spending its money effectively, and modifying its objects would enable it to do so more effectively (on charitable purposes) then the Commission would be likely to support the change of objects.

the proportion of subs transferred into the BRF can be changed very easily. Also there is case for considering registering the whole society as a charity, where there is then — Roger Booth

The ODG AGM normally votes to make a substantial grant to thee bell fund but this year the trustees said it didn't need any more money,over and aabove its other sources of income, so no donation was made.

I can relate to that. There was a sweet factory behind the house where I grew up, with extractor fans on the roof. If you listened for it you could hear them but otherwise wouldn't notice them. But the sound really wound my father up, to the point where he even went through the process of trying to get rates relief on the grounds of noise interference.

We have had a published policy, available on our website, since 2017, see: Here We are about to consider revising it after a complaint from someone working at home during a weekday morning peal. Previously we considered weekdays would not cause undue disturbance but WFH has changed things so we might consider closing the shutters that face the nearest houses during peals.

it sounds like an unfortunate situation, and maybe there are undertones that limit what can or should be done. But from the information given my thoughts are:
1. I assume the complaints about sound in the churchyard come from people living next yo it, not from those interred there.
2. How serious are the complaints? Was it an isolated one off moan from a one off situation or is it a real hardship in a recurring situation?
3. Could you improve the synthetic sound, for example better speakers, different pitch or a different audio file?
4. If you can get hold of a sound meter it would be worth measuring the sound levels at various points with and without the sound control shutters closed. 20dB difference is fairly effective.
5. Are the shutters significantly less effective on some sides than others? If so are the closing properly, and check for a poor fit or missing seals.

It can certainly be hard to develop as a ringer without a stable environment in which to practice. It's not clear in this case whether it's method ringing or just good striking that is the goal, but for someone not to feel safe after ringing 7 years (I assume ringing familiar, normal bells) suggests something is wrong.
The ability to handle a bell safely is the core skill on which everything else builds. If you don't feel confident that you can safely handle whatever the bell does then that distraction will undermine everything else you try to do.
As a teacher I see helping the learner to feel at ease with the bell, and to develop the confidence that goes with it, as an integral part of initial teaching - an essential stage on the learner's progression to 'flying solo'.

He was told that the bell was too light for him. When he reported this to me I immediately told him that the bell was not too light, he was not ringing it correctly — Phillip George

I agree he should have been told that ringing light bells isn't easy, that it requires a specific technique, and how to do it. Ideally he would have had another go with someone standing with him to give advice. However, we don't know the overall context, who was present, the overall needs of them practice, and so on. If he was too far out of his comfort zone and unlikely to succeed on that bell on that occasion even with advice then it was reasonable to say the bell was too light for him 'for now' since he needed a bit more practice to be able to ring it.

It would help to know how big it is. You didn't answer Lucy's question. My guess is not very big, but pictures can be misleading.

no, I think the frame is complete, if a little unusual. The straight piece would be bolted to the wall, probably vertical. That carries the pivot for one end of the headstock, and the curved piece coming form it, probable downward, carries the pivot at the othe end. That should be adequate to support the weight of the bell, and since it only swings through a small angle there shouldn't be large lateral forces.
All this is conjecture of course. I am simply reverse engineering what is visible.

definitely rung by swinging. The thin lever attached to the headstock would have the rope/cord/wire attached to it.
It would have been fixed to a wall with the thick part of the frame attached to it.