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Oliver Lee

As they are due to be removed at the end of the month for rehanging my Father and I decided to join Bedford for some service ringing and I'm sorry to say that the experience was far from enjoyable, although we cleared our visit with the tower captain a couple of days previously we received what I can only describe as a frosty reception but as two of my friends were present I decided to ignore it with hindsight however I really should've taken this as a warning of what was to come!, whilst there were more then enough people to have rung a touch of Grandsire triples on the back eight the ringing Master instead choose to ring a decidedly boring set of rounds on 12 with a placed band during which he fussed incessantly about the striking and made some uncalled for remarks on my bell handling!, eventually I grew more then a little fed up of this but the biggest insult came when he at point blank refused to let me ring the tenor because I was a visitor and not one of his "locals". has anyone else encountered unfriendly towers like this? I've visited many places across the country for service ringing and with the exception of yesterday I have always received a very warm welcome

Phillip George

eventually I grew more then a little fed up of this but the biggest insult came when he at point blank refused to let me ring the tenor because I was a visitor and not one of his "locals". — Oliver Lee

Oliver, you have explained your visit to Bedford from your point of view and I do not wish to comment on it because I was not there. However, as you have commented publicly, I will say that I support any tower captain/ringing master in their decision whether or not to allow any ringer to ring the tenor or any other particular bell. ....None of us has a right to ring! .....we do so only with permission of the church under the guidance of (church) appointed leaders. When visiting a tower we should respect the decisions made locally, including what methods and how many bells are rung. You might have an opinion about this but yours is not to reason why! You said that the ringing master did not allow you to ring the tenor because you were not one of the locals. There could be a reason for this e.g. the condition/go of the bell? If you feel so strongly aggrieved I would suggest that you contact the tower captain and ask if he would be kind enough give you a more detailed explanation. I hope you are able to resolve this.

Oliver Lee

↪Phillip George

I did follow the guidance Philip, If I wanted I could've grabbed the tenor and refused to budge but because I am generally a respectful person I asked the RM very kindly if I could take the tenor for the last set of rounds and instead of saying something along the lines of " yes of course you can" or "not this time but you can when the bells are back" he bluntly told me no because "he" had to place the band and even after I'd explained that I'd had experience with heavy tenors he sarcastically retorted "oh I bet you have" as if he didn't actually believe me. I will in due course contact the tower captain to discuss the matter further but I have already decided that this will be my one and only visit to Bedford, I don't usually say this about towers I've been to but this has left a sour taste in the mouth and I find it especially sad that this had to be my memory of them given that a friend of mine used to ring there in the early 70s

Chris Turner

Oliver. Phillip George is quite correct, as were the actions of the Bedford tower captain. (I do not ring anywhere near Bedford, by the way.)
I would do exactly the same at my home tower on a Sunday morning - ring as many bells as I could, as well as I could. I would place my bands and probably suggest to anyone who asked to ring a specific bell, when I was unsure how they might ring it, to join us on practice night, when this option would be allowed.

Simon Ridley

The fact your consider other people's ringing "boring" says something. The fact your choose to raise the issue on a public forum, I presume to try and "shame" the locals and TC, says even more.
Your complaint may or may not be legitimate, but bringing it up here, as a visitor, and without giving the TC a right to reply, comes across as churlish and not the sort or person I would want to have to manage in a tower.

Peter Sotheran

↪Oliver Lee

As others have said, as a visitor, you are a guest in the tower and it is not your place to ask for or indeed expect to be allowed to ring whatever you want. Service ringing in particular demands ringing of the highest standard and it is entirely up to the TC to place a band such that he can get the best result.

We once had a notorious tenor-grabber visited our tower; he may have fancied himself as a 'tenor-king' but his striking was such that he was nick-named 'Lightning' due his inability to strike in the same place twice. We took secret delight in placing each band in such away that he never grabbed our tenor! Take care that you don't fall into the same category!

Oliver Lee

↪Peter Sotheran

well I'm pleased to say I'm not like that, I've rung several tenors to quarters over the years and a lot of people have commented favourably on how good my striking is. I do remember one instance though on an outing where our youth co Ordinator had a right proper moan at the "lightnings" amongst claiming that If we rang like that with some bands we wouldn't be asked to tenor again, eight years later I do think she had a point.

John de Overa

If I wanted I could've grabbed the tenor and refused to budge — Oliver Lee

I'm pleased to say I'm not like that — Oliver Lee

Hmm, really?

David Smith

For me, reading the opening remark in this chat, the warning lights came on with statement "whilst there were more then enough people to have rung a touch of Grandsire triples on the back eight the ringing Master instead choose to ring a decidedly boring set of rounds on 12". There are many good reasons for ringing on all 12, even if it's rounds, just are there are many good reasons for choosing Grandsire Triples. The locals, and the Ringing Master in particular, would be aware of the relevant criteria for this specific occasion, but a visitor would not. While a visitor might well be disappointed with a decision, they really are not in a position to criticise it - and the judgemental word "boring" further suggests that the visitor was applying his preferences and wishes rather than fitting in with what the Ringing Master wanted - not really appropriate behaviour for a visitor.

I agree that most bands are welcoming, but achieving a good outcome with visitors is a two-way process.

Adam Greenley

I'm with everyone else on this. When I visit other towers, I am more than happy to make up numbers for whatever the tower captain decides to ring, and expect visitors at my tower to do the same. It would be interesting to get your take if you had rung Grandsire Triples on the back 8, but hadn't rung the full 12, despite there being enough there to do it. The tower captain is ultimately responsible for the sound coming from the tower on a Sunday.
If you had previously tried to make "helpful suggestions" to the tower captain about what they might like to ring, may explain the response when you then asked to ring the tenor.
This sounds to me more like a lesson in being a good visitor rather than one on being a welcoming tower...

Oliver Lee

↪John de Overa

the Point in my Original post was supposed to be sarcastic, I'd never ever under any circumstances grab hold of a rope without asking and thinking about it I kind of wish I hadn't even written it!

John de Overa

There are many good reasons for ringing on all 12, even if it's rounds — David Smith

Exactly, For example, for many people Sunday ringing has an element of religious observance, that should be respected. If that means Rs/CCs so everyone gets a ring, that's what should happen.

he fussed incessantly about the striking — Oliver Lee

And he should be commended for doing so. Sundays are the band's regular "performance". The TC will know what his band will be able to ring best. If that's Rs/CCs rather than crashy GS, then that's what should be rung.

We regularly ring 60 on 3rds on Sundays, we don't ring it at practices, everyone understands why and agrees with it.

There's a precedence chain in in any tower, a visitor is at the opposite end of it to the TC

Oliver Lee

↪Simon Ridley

I'm not churlish Simon, I know I come across as such in my Original post but that is not what I am and many of my ringing friends will testify to it. the incident at Bedford was a genuine complaint but thinking about it with Hindsight I should've really contacted the tower captain privately rather then airing my grievances on a public forum like this. I will ensure that I do so if anything like this occurs again

Peter Sotheran

I fear we are not winning this argument! There should be no 'grievance' to be aired. As a visitor you are a guest in the tower. With very few, if any exceptions, it is not for a visitor to complain about the way a TC runs a ringing session. To do so, whether in public or in private, is to imply that you know better and to criticise his/her ability. Whatever the ringing, when you leave the tower, you thank them, smile politely and tip a few £1 coins in the tower fund box.

John de Overa

↪Peter Sotheran

:up:

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