Ringing Forums

We had a branch outing this summer, most ringing was PH5 PBD or call changes. At the 8 bell tower we gave opportunities to several ringers to try out ph7. There was 1 piece of ringing more advanced which was some mediocre grandsire triples with our PBD ringers on the treble and two. But what less experienced ringers could see was an achievable path to progression. One ringer who has not been ringing long, said afterwards that grandsire was amazing, "until now I though a goal was to ring for a wedding but now I can see there's so much more I can aspire to". Our approach to branch general ringing is to focus on giving opportunities to people who attend. Those of us who ring "fancy-pants" stuff have so many opportunities already and in my view general branch practices shouldn't contain very much advanced ringing as its a suitable time we can give more opportunities for the less experienced to try something new or ring with a steady band.

that’s interesting, in my tower the TC just wants to focus on Grandsire, but won’t encourage people to learn the method.
He also refuses to learn touches wanting to focus on the plain course, but always rings the plain course on the same bell and messes it up.
Unfortunately bad habits are to blame!
But as TC won’t encourage others to progress, j have to do this as the area ringing master … but it gets a bit delicate

in my view general branch practices shouldn't contain very much advanced ringing — Charlotte Boyce

I understand the sentiment but I think it’s too simple. I think all practices should include as mix that gives everyone present something of benefit. Obviously given the time available and people present that might entail some compromises but should still be the aim. With a lot of less capable fringes present that’s will mean a lot of basic stuff, but even then it can be a mix that offers individuazlsx and other both comfort zone and challenging opportunities. And don’t forget that the more expedrtienced ringers you rely on to provide solidazrity for those Lees’s capaable also need motivating. Include something for their benefit too. Quite apart from being fair, it will make them more likely to come to the next one.

I think everyone at a practise should get a balanced amount of ringing

However some focussed practises are advantageous.

But there needs to be focussed practices for all levels

How does he think that's ever going to work? Sounds like he can only ring by bell numbers himself?

Our progress has been internally led and there have been a number of things that have helped: getting the bells rehung, a smooth handover between the retiring and new TC, an excellent new TC, a "returning ringer" who retired back to the area and most recently our new vicar, who is a Surprise Major ringer and came to our practices before he was even in post! And probably most importantly, a band who have a realistic understanding of where they are at and the challenges ahead, but who want to have a go, who are very supportive of each other and who's attitude is "We are all in this together". There's still a long way to go, but people seem to be enjoying the journey.

I think it's much more difficult in your scenario, "it gets a bit delicate" sounds like a huge understatement :grin: I wonder if the way forwards is a parallel path for those who want to "get on" and can't do so in their home towers, with separate reasonably local and fairly frequent practices? I learned to ring mostly outside of my home tower and I've seen that approach work well in one guild I ring in, but the culture there is that people ring in more than one tower from the start, so nobody bats an eyelid. I think it's much trickier to extricate people from "stuck in a rut" towers without causing all sort of ructions.

I do suspect he might have learned “who to follow” but always goes on about places counting.

It sounds like your towers are going well, but because of certain proactive individuals. We need more of them.

I am planning a better structure of ringing as part of wearebellringing

But there needs to be focussed practices for all levels — Martyn Bristow

I think there also needs to be overlap between practices. You don't need to be a Surprise Major ringer before you can start to support those on the lower rungs of the ladder. It's not realistic or fair to expect people at the upper levels to provide support all the way down (although of course it's great if they do), and there aren't the numbers needed to do that anyway.

And there are benefits to everyone involved - our ringers who are further on have learned the skills needed to "ring around" wobbly learners, and will stand behind them if asked. That's not just benefited the learners, the more advanced folks have commented on how much it's helped them as well. A rising tide lifts all boats, and all that.

there needs to be focussed practices for all levels — Martyn Bristow

Our branch runs elementary, intermediate and advanced practices each month (as well as a weekday afternoon and Saturday practice for all levels). The most successful is the elementary, with strong attendance. The intermediate grew out of that (to take forward the more advanced cohort) and is more focused. The advanced practice used to be S8 but was broadened after Covid when numbers dropped.
All of them provide for things people can't get in their own tower. The slight exception is the advanced practice, which although it is all 'advanced' is less advanced than the top end of our weekly tower practice. Many of our ringers don't attend branch practices - a bit chicken and egg..

I do suspect he might have learned “who to follow” but always goes on about places counting. — Martyn Bristow

Yeah, I've seen that as well - they rattle on about places but will only ring plain courses and on one bell :wink:

It sounds like your towers are going well, but because of certain proactive individuals. We need more of them. — Martyn Bristow

I'm sure there are more out there, I think finding and supporting them will be the trick. How best to do that is a difficult question...

Our branch runs elementary, intermediate and advanced practices each month — John Harrison

What sort of level are each of those?

as well as a weekday afternoon and Saturday practice for all levels — John Harrison

So how many opportunities are you providing each month? It sounds like at least five?

Branches around me seem to think one monthly practice is enough, and quite often they are more like outings than teaching practices. I'm sure that's fine once you reach a certain level, but for people trying to progress, once a month is nothing like often enough.

I’m hoping we can get something going at a higher level
Currently there are patches … but it’s not enticing more people to join and progress

What sort of level are each of those? — John de Overa

Elementary has a lot of exercises to help develop core skills (ART based) as well as hunting and s8m0le methods. Intermediate was spun off as a separate practice for those who had progressed most in the elementary. It is more focused with each practice working on specific methods beyond PB, and also including 8 bell ringing. Advanced is from Stedman 7 and TB up to S8.

how many opportunities are you providing each month? — John de Overa

Slightly more including one or two youth ringing activities (shared with adjacent branches). The monthly plan includes elementary, intermediate, advanced and daytime practices plus 3rd Saturday, which most months is a practice except for AGM and two striking competitions. However, not all practices are held. We check for numbers in advance and cancel if there are too few. That avoids anyone turning up and being disappointed. See: http://odg.org.uk/sdb/diary/

Thanks for the details, and that's a very impressive diary page!

it’s a lot of hard work by the ringing masters and others. The number of practices built up over the last few decades. 40-50 years ago we just had the monthly Saturday practice (minus AGM and competitions) but they lasted 3 hours, whereas now they only last an hour and a half.
OTOH we often has over 30 ringers present in the 80s (I suspect not all present for the whole time, but it’s a long time ago and I can’t remember). Now we get smaller numbers attending, see: https://odg.org.uk/sdb/documents/misc/MemberAttendance23.pdf

There's actually a more up to date version of that analyais at: http://odg.org.uk/sdb/documents/misc/MemberAttendance24.pdf

I think tracking attendance is a good idea, although some people might be off put.
But understanding trends is valuable
Do people push back
What do you capture

at each practice people write their names in the attendance book. We’ve done that for years, I suspect well before all safeguarding came along.
Sometimes we also write down what was rung.
That’s the easy bit. Totting up the number at each event is easy too s we can compare over the years. When we were thinking about the best time to for Saturday practices it helped to see whether morning, afternoon or evening got better attendance. (There was no pattern, all had high and lows.)
The analysis by individual took quite a bit of work to transcribe the information into a spreadsheet. I first did it to compare pre and post Covid. Having got the framework in place it was less effort to add another year.