Ringing Forums

Richard Norman

Hi
Recently tightened our frame bolts so read the manual (again) and a few issue-ettes that you might consider for the next edition
First you refer to us a ‘steeple keepers’ (SK); well the guy who trained me was but we only have a tower so a misnomer? Tower keeper? Most churches with steeples (1) have towers to hold the steeple up
Chapter 4
Open ended spanners are necessary, used to loosen/tighten square nuts (2) which many SKs (?) will come across often on older wooden wheels (on CSS see below)
P16 spirit level – IF the slider board should be level (some at least are not??)
Chapter 5
You refer to the split pin – in the trade we called them ‘cotter pins’ BUT
Cup Square Hexagon CSX (more common these days) and
Cup Square Square CSS still around and rusty in many bell chambers and I guess there may still be a few in stock and on sale (hopefully not rusty)
Finally a ‘set’ is threaded (set) right up to the head (thread to head) whereas as you say a bolt has an unthreaded portion of ‘shank’ under the head (3)
I guess I will come across a few other items as we work on various areas ,
Best regards
Richard

1 Also it is fairly rare to find a frame and ring in a steeple, most that I am aware of are in the tower even if there is a steeple above
2 But you are correct the open end should not be used on hexagon nuts for the reason stated
3 Some CSX these days are (and even CSS in the past were) thread to head and thus accurately NOT bolts

J Martin Rushton

Err, <pedant>a steeple is the assemblage of tower and spire, not just the spire.</pedant>

From the OED:
"A steeple is the tower of a Church with all its appendages, as turret, octagon, and spire. It is often incorrectly confounded with the spire."

W. F. Hook, Church Dictionary (1871) 725

John Harrison

You refer to the split pin – in the trade we called them ‘cotter pins’ — Richard Norman

I'm not 'in the trade' but I've never heard a split pin called a cotter pin. More to the point, a cotter pin is completely different, it's a pin with a taper used to hold things together, for example on a bike pedal to fix the cranks to the shaft.

Richard Norman

↪John Harrison

Yes I am aware of that use for the term e.g. 'holding' a chain wheel onto the bottom bracket axle of a bicycle however as I say in the trade that term was used for what we all generally call a split pin. If you think about it the cotter pin on a cycle is there to prevent rotation as is a split pin when placed in a castellated nut :-)

J Martin Rushton

A cotter pin has a variety of meanings:

a pin or wedge passing through a hole to fix parts tightly together [British usage]
a metal fastener with two tines that are bent during installation [US usage]
R-clips [US usage]
circle cotters; similar to a keyring but with one end protruding inwards to locate in a hole [US usage]

However, in some trades US usage has crossed the pond, maybe this has happened in Richard's case?

John de Overa

Potato, Potato.

Perhaps you should agree to split the difference? :rofl:

https://www.engineering.com/story/pins-roll-pins-cotter-pins-and-keys-selecting-the-right-pin-for-mechanical-assembly

J Martin Rushton

Excellent. Thanks.

Peter Sotheran

Yes, I can agree with Richard-N, although not an engineer, I would refer to the device as a 'cotter pin'. Perhaps the term is on the cusp of becoming archaic as common usage these days seems to prefer 'split pin'.

As regards the correct term for the 'TMP' (Tower Maintenance Person), I'm quite happy to be the steeplepkeeper of our steeple-less tower. I like the quasi-alliterative sound of the term.

Robin Shipp

↪Richard Norman

You are reading an old book. I am happy to consider pedantry comments on Belfry Upkeep (https:\\belfryupkeep.cccbr.org.uk).

Steve Farmer

I grew up on a Farm, they were always referred to as Cotter Pins on machinery..

Mike Shelley

↪Richard Norman

Richard, is your definition of "cotter pin" correct? When the term is used with a bicycle it's the funny-shaped rods that set the pedals firmly on the shaft, without relative movement. Many cotter pins on cranks (and also certain nuts) have split pins as well to ensure that the cotter pin (or nut) cannot become detached. The modern articulated chiming hammers at my home tower are held together with split pins (not "cotter pins") because the components need to move relative to each other.

Tom Ridgman

Split pin wins on google 225 million hits versus 7.9 million for cotter pins. I think that you have to be a bit careful that pedantry doesn't overspill into technical snobbism and create the illusion that there is an elite caste that know proper words versus the knuckle draggers who might even use an adjustable spanner!

Phillip George

I use a hoofer doofer for most things. If I can't find one of those I use a thingummy bob!

Richard Norman

Thanks guys - gave me a laugh
Yes: I often bemoan the 'things that cross the pond' however where language is concerned I am mindful of the fact that American English has simply retained, inherited, a spelling or word that was in use before independence and or the Pilgrim Fathers = smile
In future I will reference the on line version of the manual although being of a certain age I prefer the paper of a book - where I can insert a bookmark (before anyone comments on that I am aware that one can do that to an electrnic version - though I am not yet certain what happens to that mark when the page is changed or replaced?)
On a completely other tack BT have made EE their cutsomer facing operation and we have thus 'been moved' with many inervitable unconsidred complexities - the pedant rests - ho hum

Ringing Forums

Pedant’s revolt

Welcome to your Ringing Forums!

Categories