Ringing Forums

What could ringing do with £1 million a year? — John de Overa

I see 'Global Grooves' is, according to their web site, supported using public funding by Arts Council England.

I'm sure there are lots of other similar documents, these were just the first ones I found, but they suggest that the "going rate" for a paid head of the CCCBR would be in the £50k - £60k p.a. range. — John de Overa

Well it's fascinating stuff, but where would the money come from?

I see the CCCBR 2022 budget seems to shrug off a £20K deficit with an income of less than £10K.

I see that there is an ad in this week's RW for a salaried Ringing Centre Manager. This must be one of the most cheerful of ringing moments. — A J Barnfield

Indeed. I must admit my interest is piqued as to who can afford to have a salaried Ringing Centre Manager?

Curiosity satisfied.

I am slightly bemused by the emphasis on structure. In central government there have been numerous attempts to solve problems with restructures. These normally eased problems in some areas, but then created all new problems in others. What they always failed to address was that the capabilities and resources of those within any of the structures didn’t change merely because they’ve been restructured.

So I applaud the efforts to up-skill ringers, but I’m not convinced of the merits of replacing one regional level structure with another. In voluntary organisation, you only have as much authority as people are prepared to give you.

Despite having posted in this thread several times, every time I see the title, I think it's about an online video teaching resource :smile:

The Surrey membership online system seems to work quite well.

https://membermojo.co.uk/surreybellringers

So what?

Whilst a national survey would be interesting, I don't see it as a prerequisite for change, I think the issues are already well known. — John de Overa

Which issues, the falling standard of ringing, the falling numbers of ringers or the falling number of ringable towers?

Perhaps a representative body for ringers might want to know what all ringers think rather than just the vociferous members.

One of the major factors holding back change in ringing is the high level of emotional attachment ringers tend to have to particular towers, associations, custom and practice and so on. — A J Barnfield

Has anyone done any research on what ringers want?

What percentage of ringers actually want to put in the effort to ring more demanding methods?
What percentage of ringers will travel distance to attend local/regional training centres?
What percentage of ringers see the art as an all consuming passion, what percentage see the art as a weekly social activity?

In short, is any research being done among ringers?

:up: Thanks!

You're missing the point. We don't have a rich source of recruits and we don't turn anyone down, and probably never will. This is about creating more recruits who are knocking on our door because they have heard how great a thing to do ringing is, they think it will suit them, and they want to learn. It is all additional. — Simon Linford

That's quite a task (you already know that). If you stopped 100 people in the street, I wonder how many of them will even had a passing thought that bell ringing is a 'thing', let alone know the first thing about it.

I'm interested to know the methodology that the marketing firm are going to use, it might be applicable at a local level. :smile:

This is right - the reason for getting outside help is that we need to see ringing from the outside to really understand how to attract the right recruits. First we do need to understand all the different motivations, all the types of people for whom ringing becomes 'their thing'. As JAH said - select those who are well suited to ringing and likely to do well. — Simon Linford

I didn't realise that bell ringing in general has such a rich source of recruits that it can afford to be selective and discard those who don't measure up.

If bands perform badly, that reflects on their ability rather than their motivation, I can't see why you would support ringers differently based on their motivation rather than ability.

A ringer's development plan will be based on their motivation rather than their ability? That's an interesting idea.

I agree that everyone doesn't want to ting S12 or whatever, and most people don't aspire to win competitions, but surely there aspire to some level of performance that gives therm and their audience satisfaction. There has to be San element of fulfilment in the ringing itself, otherwise why do it? If all you want is the social side just go straight to the pub. If all you want is to serve your church, give out hymn books or make the coffee which is much easier, or join the choir where the average standard of performance may be higher.

I don't suppose anyone wants to perform badly, but why people ring is their own business and their motives are not subject to the approval, or otherwise, of others.

There are lot of assertions being thrown around in this thread, but is there solid data to back any of it up?

Do the majority of ringers want to improve their ringing?
What is improved ringing, is it ringing what you can with greater accuracy, or ringing more complicated methods (obviously not in Devon and Cornwall), or a combination of both?
Given this is all voluntary, who is going to want to be a Tower Captain if the burden is as heavy as some are suggesting?
Are the problem of ringing solvable by a glorious one size fits all solution, a restructuring that most are not interested in or don't care about, or is it more nuanced than that?

I agree that a national structure that can bring the 'disjointed' elements together is an absolute necessity, but in seeking to replace existing structures, is there a danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater?

Hi Vicki, I realise that it’s been a really busy time for all ringers recently, but your mention of the Coronation made me think about recruiting ringers whose immediate goal would be to ring for that event.

If the coronation is in the spring, the recruitment campaign would seem to be needed in the not too distant future. Does any pre-planning exist for this please?

Somewhat surprised to find that the president doesn’t seem to find the death of Queen Elizabeth and the ringing surrounding it as a subject worth mentioning other than in passing as a possible disruption.

Unfortunate.

I’m not convinced there are degrees of democracy. The CCCBR is a representative body which can be held accountable by its members if they choose to do so.

It sounds as though you value your home tower and would like to see it rise from the ashes.

Good luck in your efforts :smile:

If you try to impose a top down structure on a bottom up activity, I foresee a whole new set of problems.

Like any voluntary pastime, you can't dictate, just lead and guide.